News Flash!

DSA is meeting back at our regular location of Greater Portland Bible Church on Saturday, June 19 at 9:00 AM!

DSA greatly appreciates use of the space at GPBC and therefore respects the GPBC Covid guidelines which are not stringent. The wearing of face masks is optional, along with six foot distancing. In addition, let us all please exercise grace for one another and not disparage others that may wish to either wear a face mask or not. Thank you.

June In Person Meeting

Rapid Formation of Caves and Speleothems Late in the Flood and During the Ice Age

with Michael Oard

Saturday, June 19th, 2021 at 9:00 AM

The formation of caves appears to take millions of years if we assume the present is the key to the past. Present processes would indicate they were formed by carbonic acid, but it is very difficult to form the initial cave opening with just carbonic acid, even if we add millions of years. However, secular scientists have discovered that some caves, especially Carlsbad Caverns and other caves in the Guadalupe Mountains of southeast New Mexico, were excavated by sulfuric acid. More and more caves are now believed to have been formed by sulfuric acid dissolution, probably a majority of them. This presents the possibility that the cave openings were formed during continental uplift during the Recessive Stage of the Flood.

Speleothems are growing today at about 0.1 to 2 mm/year, which means according to the uniformitarian hypothesis, they are only tens to hundreds of thousands of years old. This is much younger than their previous estimates.

Speleothems grow primarily by the amount of the calcium ion in the drip water, which is largely dependent upon the amount of soil carbon dioxide dissolved in the soil water. Other importance variables for stalagmites are the cave temperature, cave ventilation, the drip rate, and the thickness of the film on top. The evaporation rate could be important, if the cave is well ventilated.

The five major variables would be operating at a maximum during the Ice Age, especially the earlier part when the winters were mild, the summers cool, and the precipitation was heavy. This would result in thick soil and dense vegetation at many locations. Other conditions caused by the Flood may have greatly accelerated speleothem development. As the Flood water drained, high organic content mud probably would be left over in many areas, especially low areas of the terrain contributing to rapid speleothem growth. Some indication that organic mud could aid in speleothem growth is indicated by the largest columns in Ogle Cave that line up with valleys on the surface.

There were hundreds to thousands of meters of erosion as the continents uplifted out of the water during the Recessional Stage of the Flood. Since temperature increases downward in rock, the cave carbonate after the Flood likely would have been very warm. Since speleothems likely grow proportional to the temperature, rapid growth would be expected from this variable alone. The carbonate would cool slowly and the process of cooling would also aid in cave ventilation. Thus, many Flood and Ice Age variables would result in a very rapid speleothem growth after the Flood.

Michael Oard earned his B.S. and M.S. degrees in atmospheric science from the University of Washington. For six years he was a research meteorologist at the University of Washington, and has published several research articles in journals and technical monographs of the American Meteorological Society. Michael retired in 2001 after 30 years of employment by the National Weather Service. Since then, he has been engaged in full time research, writing, and speaking in creation earth science. He has also authored, coauthored, or served as editor of twenty-one creationist books and has published over 200 related articles in the creation science technical literature. He is a member of the Board of Directors of the Creation Research Society. Additional material written by Michael on the Flood and the Ice Age may be found at his website

This in-person meeting of DSA will be at our normal location:

Greater Portland Bible Church
2374 SW Vermont St
Portland, OR 97219

For those who can’t attend in person, the meeting will also be livestreamed at